How to protect peace: A conversation with Aspen Institute Kyiv
On the 24th of February Russia started a full-scale invasion of Ukraine. And in 2014 it had already occupied Crimea and parts of Donetsk and Luhansk regions. According to Reuters at least 1800 thousand buildings in Ukraine were destroyed and up to 30% of Ukraine’s infrastructure. The approximate value of the damaged property is $565 Billion, but the true extent of the devastation is much worse. Russian forces have destroyed whole cities, like Bucha or Mariupol, killing civilians, women and children. As of 11 April, more than 20,000 civilians had been killed in Mariupol alone.
Ukrainians will continue to fight for freedom and democratic values, according to research, more than 90% of Ukrainians are confident that their country will repeal Russia’s attack perceived as part of a Russian neo-colonial strategy. Ukraine has also received support and assistance from many in the democratic world.
On April 21st, The Aspen Institute New Zealand hosted an event in conjunction with international partner, Aspen Institute Kyiv - Ukraine’s Defence of Freedom. The main objective of this event was to create a platform for dialogue between Ukrainian leaders and support countries’ representatives about how to help Ukraine to win this war and to share first-hand experience of what is at stake in Ukraine, whilst exploring the implications of the war on Europe, Asia and the Pacific, and the World.
“We would like to share with you our first hand experience in this most horrendous war of the 21 century. We would like to learn from you the implications this war is having on your countries and societies. We would like to serve as a resource to you and your communities as everyone worldwide looks to help Ukraine, to reduce the costs of this war, and to understand what this war means to our globe.”
Chaired by Rt. Hon. Sir Don McKinnon, Chair Aspen Institute New Zealand, Former Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs of New Zealand, with opening remarks by Christine Maiden Sharp, CEO Aspen Institute New Zealand and Yuliya Tychkivska, Executive Director Aspen Institute Kyiv, joined by Ukrainian panelists:
Vasyl Myroshnychenko, Ambassador of Ukraine to Australia
Aliona Shkrum, Member of Parliament of Ukraine
Pavlo Klimkin, Minister for Foreign Affairs of Ukraine (2014-2019)
In 2022 Vasyl Myroshnychenko was appointed Ambassador Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary of Ukraine to Australia. Prior to his appointment, Vasyl was a partner of international communications consultancy “CFC Big Ideas” for 20 years. Vasyl said that Ukrainians are now experiencing something similar to Anzac Day in Australia: the birth of the Ukrainian political nation has come through military force and tragic loss over the past eight years. Through this invasion, the Ukrainian people are fully embracing the emergence of the Ukrainian political nation - Russian speakers, Ukrainian speakers, Catholics, Orthodox, Jews, and Muslims are all together united against one evil. Vasyl said ‘this has never been seen before. And because of having gone through this experience, we could never go back to what we have been before — this is just going to be a different country.’’
“Through this invasion, we fully embraced the emergence of the Ukrainian political nation. I hope that we will stop this war. But looking into the future, we can not change our geography. Russia will be there forever. Only strong Ukrainian military capacity and a strong Ukrainian economy could provide us security and safety.”
Aliona Shkrum is a Member of the Parliament of Ukraine. Aliona feels that some European countries still do not understand how we got to this and what led to this point, comparing the reasons for the war in Ukraine with the reasons which led to World War II and the calls for compromise and peace have become dangerous for all of Europe. Aliona said ‘‘Unfortunately, Putin has become the new Hitler of our generation. As French President Macron told me, there are no people in the world who can psychologically understand Putin's state right now. He has not been in contact with almost anybody for the past six months. But also it puts a question - how could we become hostages of one person in their shelter very far away”.
Aliona stressed that many European countries do not understand that the beginning of the war in Ukraine was in 2014, at the time of the Crimea annexation and Donbas invasion. And it is the point on which we should have worked for war prevention. Aliona said ‘‘I feel that some European countries still do not understand how we got to this point and what led to this point. They feel that they suddenly woke up on February 24th with explosions, killings of civilians, and something you have seen only in the history books. I think it is crucial to have a discussion about why we have got here and how to get out of this’’.
“I feel that some European countries still do not understand what led to the war in Ukraine.”
Pavlo Klimkin was the Minister for Foreign Affairs of Ukraine from 2014 — to 2019. He is sure that there is a fascist regime in Russia. Pavlo said ‘‘If you compare modern Russia with Italy in the previous century, you would not find a lot of differences. It is a purely fascist regime with a clear focus on history, creating a sort of myth out of history, having a vertical structure with a sort of medieval system of loyalty. The Soviet Union was created exactly 100 years ago. For Putin and the people around him, it is still alive, and he wants to get it back. Fundamentally for him, it is a sense of mission’’.
Many people talked about the full invasion but did not believe in it because they understood the consequences. But Pavlo Klimkin claims that Putin has no red lines: neither rational nor irrational. Pavlo followed Putin at many Normandy summits and shared his impression. Pavlo said ‘‘Now, we need bold leadership. Because Putin understands only the share of force. He expects people to act forcefully. If you do not act forcefully, you are part of rubbish for him. He is not a military guy. He is a KGB guy. He understands the road as the sequence of special operations. If you have people in charge who have a special operation mentality, it is crazy dangerous. Another special operation could blow up the whole planet’’.
Pavlo Klimkin also thinks that all negotiations could start from the point where the military deadlock would be. The future of Ukraine and all democratic worlds will be decided on the battlefield. In this case, any support is critical for Ukraine. But we need more because Putin also has the resources and resilience to fight.
“If you compare modern Russia with Italy in the 20th century, you would not find a lot of differences”
Closing statement from Christine Maiden Sharp
Thank you, Sir Don for leading a robust, though at times harrowing conversation. We all have better understanding of the extent of what’s at stake. On behalf of the Aspen Institute New Zealand, we would like to thank the panelists, the Aspen Kyiv team and everyone who has taken part in this call. We Stand with Ukraine. Nga mihi.